A Bit Disappointed (Steam Version)

[jakj]

I have not yet purchased the game yet on Steam for one reason: The achievements are disappointing. I do see that there are 13 of them, but if you actually look, there are actually only four: Start the game X times, accrue playtime, complete the tutorial, and take screenshots.

These really add no longevity or replayability to the game: They just encourage you to leave the thing on unattended, or spam open/close, once you've done what there is to do in the main game, and it gives you no sort of persistent recognition for actually playing the game itself.

Where are the achievements for completing missions, or performing unusual feats of gravitic manipulation? How about achievements for particularly spectacular explosions, or for creating absurdly large but stable solar systems? Or even achievements for completing scenarios within a certain amount of time, or within certain boundary conditions? Surely there are enough game mechanics to make interesting and challenging thresholds.

The game looks interesting, but I really get very little pleasure out of a simple singleplayer game without at least some form of online tracking of progress, because it feels like I've accomplished nothing but spent some time. If you were to announce future plans to include more interesting Steam achievements, I would purchase this game to encourage that development.

[Chaotic Cow]

I'm sure he will be adding more achievements. I think he just created a few just to have some for the release on Steam.

[Dan Dixon]

That is very fair criticism. The achievements are not as interesting as they could be.

My short reply, and sorry not responding more in depth:
The experience of manipulating reality is the reward of the game, not the achievements.

I do plan to add more achievements in a future update (although doing complex detection of simulations is hard and given my limited time even the new ones may not be good enough), but if you buy it I think you'll find the simulation itself the real reward.

[2Cryptic]

the simulation itself the real reward.

I registered to say that too, I just see the achievements as "milestones" even in games, sure people will want to grind them but they miss out on the real "zing" moments.

I look forward myself to cocking about with science, and seeing the lovely milestone pop up to say "great work, keep cocking about now" because ultimatley, this is an education tool before it is a simulated tool of destruction (re fun)

In short, I urge you to re consider what you think of as achievements, because there are some things you just cant achieve with a scripted set of requirements.

[Flynn]

The achievements are just a side incentive for the game... There is huge replayability so I personally have no idea what the OP is talking about. The game isn't meant for "achievement hunting"... It's meant for its awesomeness and the huge amounts of creativity to enables you to release.

Give it a go. I highly recommend it

[bojo]

Can't say i've ever given much thought to achievements 

[Neon]

I've never once thought about achievements. I didn't even know
there were any lol. I'm more interested in just playing with the
simulation, and coming up with ideas I can try to create.

a Ring of stars is one I played with, particularly when
they are different masses, and trying to keep it stable.
Plays on Newtons idea for equal mass equidistant objects
n where the forces are.

[Medevila]

Can't say i've ever given much thought to achievements 

Likewise.

If you base your time around achievements, your missing out. Both here, and in any other game that has them.

[jakj]

Can't say i've ever given much thought to achievements  ???

If you base your time around achievements, your missing out. Both here, and in any other game that has them.

There's a reason the concept of achievements (or feats, or gamerscore, or trophies, or what-have-you) has proliferated throughout most of the online gaming world. There aren't many modern, major, successful MMOs, consoles, or distributors left who haven't established some sort of achievement system. Even some Telnet-based MUDs have begun to adopt achievements.

Of course obsessing over achievements is neither healthy nor reasonable, just as obsessing over anything else is neither health nor reasonable. But it is inarguable that, for a very large portion of today's gaming population, achievements are meaningful and add significant value to any gaming experience.

You can call them gold stars from the teacher if you want to be derisive, and you can call them cake sprinkles if you want to be cute, but to me they are a form of collectible, just as stamps, coins, and such things are. Think about how many games have some sort of collectible, all the way back to the VAX days, and then think of achievements as just another type of collectible.

Achievements also serve as a sort of current or steering mechanism for some people: It's a form of goal-oriented gameplay. Don't think of it as leading the user by the hand, but rather like a guy standing over your shoulder, just watching you have fun, who every once in a while taps you on the shoulder and says "Hey, buddy, if you do this and that, something neat will happen. Why don't you try it?". It serves as a gateway to the more interesting parts of a game, some of the most unique elements, for those of us who may like discovering fun little tidbits but are very bad at doing so.

I'm not trying to argue that achievements should be a dominant force in a game's development. I'm just saying that they are one more thing that can (for some) make a mediocre game good, and make a great game glorious.

I'm pleased to see the developer plans to add some as time goes on. I'm not worried about getting them in any sort of hurry: All I'm interested in is that at some point, when the development cycle has a window open, it's on the wishlist.

If you're not interested in them at all, that's fine, because we're all different. Just understand, psychologically, why they are not universally a waste of time.

[Jet Black]

I'm not concerned about the achievements, but did want to know whether the Photographer achievement only counts in-game shots? I'm more likely to take Steam screenshots to upload than in game ones (again, not that it matters - just wondering).

[Carnage2K4]

while I could think of many more achievements that could be added, I don't think there really that important as this is a simulation & not like a platform game with a story and end sequence with bosses and the like.

[Someone Else]

Actually, I'd say that achievements in general have to be one of the most - if not the most - useless "innovations" in gaming. They do have some value, but when people base their purchase of a game around whether or not they like the achievements (a feature which doesn't actually add anything to the gameplay itself) or even go out of their way to buy games which have easy achievements to boost their 360 gamerscore or PS3 trophies, you have to wonder whether or not they were such a good idea.

But I will say that the game could be greatly improved by giving the player some kind of objectives or goal-oriented missions to play around with. Stuff like "make a solar system that survives for 5 million years that contains 5 planets and 5 moons" to give players ideas of what to do on their own. These could take the form of achievements, or they could be stand-alone simulations to play with like the tutorials.

[Omnigeek6]

The experience of manipulating reality is the reward of the game, not the achievements.
if you buy it I think you'll find the simulation itself the real reward.

Absolutely this.

Personally, I don't think of US as a game. If I were told to categorize all my software based on function, I would file Universe sandbox with my CAD, fractal terrain, and image editing programs.

[MassiveEffect]

These really add no longevity or replayability to the game...

Not exactly, it is a sandbox type simulator.  The re playability is limitless to be honest.
I don't see how someone can base Universe Sandboxes' longevity on steam achievements.


Try it out Universe Sandbox is great.

[bojo]

Totally agree MassiveEffect, the replayability is in itself the fact that this is a sandbox simulator.
If you're limited in scope for what you can do with it, then it's not a sandbox.

The only game i've ever seen with achievements that were worth time and effort were the ones in WoW.
Some of those took months even years to complete so I can understand taking the time and effort to get them because they gave you bragging rights and a feeling of accomplishment.

But I think the kind of achievements that you see listed on steam games are largely pointless. Achievement Kill 20 zombies: Aren't I going to do that during the course of the game anyway?

I've never focused on them on these games because as i've stated there's no real sense of achievement in doing them. They seem to be nothing more than icons that light up when you do something mundane. They rarely ever unlock anything (unlike the wow ones that gave you mounts, gear, titles etc) so why bother with them?

To base the purchase of a game on external icons that do nothing of interest to affect the game just seems kinda silly. Especially when it's pretty obvious that you want to play the game.

[dhm794]

Universe Sandbox is literally just a sandbox.  There is no object to the game.  It's simply for learning
and experimenting with astrophysics. 

[LimitlessAeon]

I have purchased many steam games from the Steam service, but this isn't even a game. This is a simulator. What exactly were you looking for when you saw this in the store? Are steam achievements a deciding factor when you purchase games from Steam? I hate to sound like I'm mocking you (because I'm not), It's just a little funny to see someone have this view/opinion.

[jakj]

I have purchased many steam games from the Steam service, but this isn't even a game. This is a simulator. What exactly were you looking for when you saw this in the store? Are steam achievements a deciding factor when you purchase games from Steam? I hate to sound like I'm mocking you (because I'm not), It's just a little funny to see someone have this view/opinion.

You're entitled to your opinion just as I'm entitled to mine. My wall of text earlier in this thread lays out my explanation for my personality as well as I can. I understand that it is difficult to comprehend and relate to someone who is interested in achievements if you are not so, but part of society is expanding your mind and learning how to undertand different people.

Yes, the presence or absence of acheivements has decided what games I get at times, because I have neither the money nor the time to play every game in the library. I did get this game, in fact, have gone through the tutorials, and I like it, but I've played only about ten minutes in it and don't have any particular desire right now to go further into it.

I don't regret my purchase: The program is well-designed and I see a bright future for it because of the level of developer involvement. I don't dislike the game: It's pretty, it works, and space is interesting. But I have lots of achievements yet to get in other games, ones that are involved and interesting (particularly ones that add replayability to a game's main campaign, putting alternate victory conditions on a familiar mission). That's just how my mind works, and as I said, just look at the popularity and spread of the concept of achievements to see just how many of "me" there are.

Like I said, I did purchase this game on Steam, and it still feels like the right decision, even though I'm not using my purchase. I feel more like it was an investment, a purchase of a future product rather than a present one. I look forward to seeing what comes to Universe Sandbox as time goes on.

[Dan Dixon]

I feel more like it was an investment, a purchase of a future product rather than a present one.

Thanks for the investment.

I look forward to seeing what comes to Universe Sandbox as time goes on.

I look forward to developing new features and sharing them with everyone. Thanks again.

[Ramierez]

These really add no longevity or replayability to the game: They just encourage you to leave the thing on unattended, or spam open/close, once you've done what there is to do in the main game, and it gives you no sort of persistent recognition for actually playing the game itself.

Where are the achievements for completing missions, or performing unusual feats of gravitic manipulation? How about achievements for particularly spectacular explosions, or for creating absurdly large but stable solar systems? Or even achievements for completing scenarios within a certain amount of time, or within certain boundary conditions? Surely there are enough game mechanics to make interesting and challenging thresholds.

The game looks interesting, but I really get very little pleasure out of a simple singleplayer game without at least some form of online tracking of progress, because it feels like I've accomplished nothing but spent some time. If you were to announce future plans to include more interesting Steam achievements, I would purchase this game to encourage that development.

The simple answer has already been provided - This isn't really that type of game.  The objective is to play around with it and have fun as you see fit.  There are no real scenarios to complete or objectives to be met.  Also, there would be no ability to get an achievement for doing Y in X amount of time since we are the lords of our universes and have full control over the speed of time.

Maybe at some point in the future, Dan will think of some little mini-game or develop some type of objective-based missions that you can play, but until then, the standard thought regarding achievements really doesn't apply here.

I'm not saying that there's anything wrong specifically with your type of playstyle, but I will submit that I think you are probably missing out on the true idea of the fun to be had here.

The only personal example I can give is the fact that I like to play Left for Dead 2.  I currently have all but 1 achievements that steam has for the game and I have been at this point for probably well over a year I guess.  I could easily get the last one at any time (Port of Scavenge)  I haven't simply because I hate scavenge mode.  The majority of the others came from just playing or me and my friends just deciding to go for it on a whim.  Did I purposely set in out pursuit of any of them? Perhaps a few, but it was more because I was already there and doing it, so might as well go for it.  They were a side thing to add into the objective I was already seeking.

I'm sure if you have any ideas for some achievements that would apply to the game as it currently is that you would like to see, it would be something to be taken under advisement as an update or what have you.  Currently the things you mentioned would not really work and is probably why they aren't already included.

[jimthev]

The experience of manipulating reality is the reward of the game, not the achievements.

This is theoretically true for every single game ever made.  Yet, the pervasiveness of achievements proves that they also hold value to many people.  They are the customer, they define the value of the product to them.  Ignoring or discounting the current market trend(s) is dangerous.  That said, I think you have a realistic subset of achievements that are available in Garry's Mod which seems to be the best game for comparison.

Personally I could care less about achievements, but I'm not so foolish as to think that I define the game market.  If I had my way, all those damn kids would get off of my lawn and go back to playing hangman, uphill, both ways, with their pants pulled up and their face in books without twittering about it.

Off topic:  In any case, I picked up copies of the Steam version for me and my kid because who doesn't like exploding the Earth?  We are have had several game crashes but it is still fun.  Keep up the good work!

[spaceless]

Ignoring or discounting the current market trend(s) is dangerous.

While this is true, I still find that games/software made out of true motivation for the subject are mostly way better than those cash-cowed. And it is noticed, when something is cash-cowed, on the other hand it is noticed when there is true interest.
I still can't believe what they've done to Assassin's Creed...at first they said it will be a tilogy as a whole, probably already thought through the concept. Now there's an Ezio-trilogy INSIDE the initial trilogy. Just because the company is following the trail of money now they threw overboard the original concept, which probably would have been absolutely epic, in order to make six games indtead of three, because that means double the money. I hate it, I was already bored of Ezio in Brotherhood, now there's even coming a third Ezio's Creed....woach.

I'm drifting away, but I guess you get what I mean.
Please, Dan, always do as YOU see fit within Universe Sandbox, that way the quality will keep high.

[Darvince]

Sandboxes such as this game have the longevity of: How many projects can you think of to do in it?