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General Category => Everything Else => Topic started by: Bla on July 02, 2011, 06:46:46 AM

Title: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on July 02, 2011, 06:46:46 AM
Have you heard/read about a bill in USA which could make it illegal to share videos of copyrighted materials (including games)? Only in The Free Country of USA, of course. But it still seems ridiculous... Here's a video about it:

Bill S.978: The End of Let's Plays and Gaming Streams? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ib7-vSrp6y8#ws)
The video also has a link where all you hopefully angry USAmerican gamers can complain to your law-makers. :)

Link to the bill itself: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s112-978 (http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s112-978)

What are your thoughts about it?

I think the whole idea of copyright is one of the many sad results of a money-driven world, just like the planned obsolecense of games (well, pretty much anything which can be sold). It scares me every time I upload a video on YouTube. :P I think it'd be much easier and less scary if people would just have to be credited for their work.
Now that we live in such a world, I do see why movie makers etc. don't want their movies uploaded, because they have to make money. But how any video game company (like those who made Gran Turismo 5) can be against it is beyond me. It simply puzzles me why they won't let us upload our races to YouTube, it's free advertising and, as they said in the video above, every time you play the game, you have a different experience (as opposed to movies), so it shouldn't harm them.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: deoxy99 on July 02, 2011, 09:14:55 AM
Someone on YouTube commented about it, and I didn't really react to it, but now I am mad at the United States Government.

The USA is getting less free each day it seems. You will soon not be able to do much, and I will soon move away from the USA to get away from it, but that may not happen and the government will snap out of it and stop doing this (nearly impossible from what I see).
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 09:42:43 AM
I've read about it. To be honest, it's quite stupid and unfair to take down almost half of Youtube's videos, since that's usually one's life as a Youtuber. Hopefully the government unapproves this, or the future may be dramatic.

I would give a more detailed statement, but I just woke up.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 02, 2011, 10:01:34 AM
idk but on Steam the other day (June 27 i think) they announced that something in the supreme court passed saying that games are protected by the 1st amendment...

I agree with you as well Bla, it is free advertising, so that's quite stupid. Plus watching a game being played isn't as fun as PLAYING it. And hopefully this wouldn't apply to free games? There would be no point in that... And with the credit thing, everything I release is usually under a Creative Commons license telling you can use it, but to give credit to the author.

That's why Linux shall rule the world! FREE SOURCE CODE FOR ALL!!!

In Three Days Grace's words:
"LET'S START A RIOT! A RIOT! LET'S START A RIOT!" :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 10:04:21 AM
I have a feeling... Internet vs. Government. That's just in my head, anyways.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 02, 2011, 10:07:31 AM
I remember 7th grade in school... You can't be accused for some law that wasn't in effect until after you did it... So no worries at least. :P I don't know if that applies to the fact that you can still keep the video up.  :-\
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on July 02, 2011, 10:41:40 AM
I don't think the law will make it and be implemented.

But I still think, if it were implemented, that the companies could tell you to delete your videos.

Also, I'm sorry, but I don't like freedom rants. :P USA has never been a free country. The only country which would be completely free would be a complete anarchy. Freedom isn't always good. You will always need traffic rules, laws telling people not to kill each other and things like that.
But I think USA gets some freedoms completely wrong, because some freedoms are good, and others aren't. I think USA gets it completely wrong when it thinks people of the same gender marrying each other is more dangerous than everyone being able to buy weapons.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 10:44:40 AM
Well six states (sixth was New York as of 2011) allowed same-gender marriages, so kol.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on July 02, 2011, 10:53:07 AM
I know. I'm just saying it because most people who go on freedom rants (possibly not deoxy99) are conservatives who oppose it, but think everyone should be allowed to own guns, etc. It's just so incredibly hypocritical.

And in Denmark, we can't either. We can enter civil unions. I personally don't care, I'd never step into a church and get married, and how any gay person wants to have anything to do with that religion is beyond me to the same levels as a Jew having anything to do with Nazism (here I could also use gays as an example, since the Nazis killed them too, but the Jew/Nazi contrast always seems to shine brightest). Being able to call it marriage, that's fine I guess.

When we'll get a socialist/social democratic government later this year, I think we'll finally become a secular country and I think discriminating against LGBT people will be banned in the church.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 02, 2011, 11:35:25 AM
If you become a socialist country the US will ban users that are socialist and we can't talk to you anymore. :'(

:P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on July 02, 2011, 11:46:27 AM
We've had several socialist and social democratic governments before. The social democrats is the party which had been our government the most years. So... :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 11:58:01 AM
Vietnam is socialist and they aren't banned ...
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 02, 2011, 12:01:36 PM
One more country will make the limits.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 12:22:11 PM
Laos.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Darvince on July 02, 2011, 12:30:15 PM
The only country which would be completely free would be a complete anarchy.
This is why Somalia is the only "free" country. And noone likes Somalia.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 12:43:02 PM
And noone likes Somalia.

Quote
The current Transitional Federal Government is approved by the Arab League (AL), Organisation of the Islamic Conference (OIC), the African Union (AU) and Intergovernmental Authority on Development (IGAD).

/facepalm
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Darvince on July 02, 2011, 12:44:16 PM
/facepalm
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 02, 2011, 01:01:21 PM
We're Somalia and we've got pirates.

/facepalm
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Darvince on July 02, 2011, 01:04:49 PM
/me/me
/me
/me
/me
/me
/me
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Naru523 on July 02, 2011, 10:01:50 PM
Here's the bill (http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s112-978) if you guys want to read it.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 02, 2011, 11:19:21 PM
All you have to do is not record a video game that costs $2,500, or not post 10 videos in 180 days. Post a really really really long video every 19 days and you're alright.

Take that government! :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Dan Dixon on July 03, 2011, 08:16:04 AM
If this bill passes I'll provide a clear exemption for non-commercial and educational use of video taken from Universe Sandbox.

I'm also working on very open ended commercial license for video and images. I'll be posting that soon.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on July 03, 2011, 09:07:13 AM
Notch says he'll probably end up doing something like that too, iirc. (Your first paragraph)
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 16, 2011, 07:53:36 AM
Dun dun dun.

http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?cl=1392740568 (http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?cl=1392740568)
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: FiahOwl on November 16, 2011, 08:05:55 AM

This message is only viewable with Universe Sandbox Galaxy Edition. Access it and much more with promo-code '47252'.

Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 16, 2011, 08:44:58 AM
As long as there is money, there will always be corruption.
But politicians being able to have their campaigns financed by corporations with lots of money probably helps a lot. ^^
(At least the politicians which want to cut taxes and improve everything for the corporations)
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: deoxy99 on November 16, 2011, 09:44:32 AM
I actually wish our country was socialist (and when I was typing this, I was so tempted to capitalize socialism).
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 16, 2011, 10:32:08 AM
I wish the entire world was socialist. :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: deoxy99 on November 16, 2011, 10:59:36 AM
Me too. :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: smjjames on November 16, 2011, 11:20:16 AM
Only problem is that the socialist/communist system just doesn't work very well economically in the long run.

Yes I know people would point out China, but I'm referring to the former Soviet Union and China does have it's own problems with the economy among other stuff, and it's more of a hybrid.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 16, 2011, 01:45:13 PM
Only problem is that the socialist/communist system just doesn't work very well economically in the long run.

Yes I know people would point out China, but I'm referring to the former Soviet Union and China does have it's own problems with the economy among other stuff, and it's more of a hybrid.
China is certainly hybrid. You're welcome to dig into their problems and we shall see if they're because of Socialism.

The Soviet Union did well for a long time - it had more than 10% growth for many years around the 1950's. USA undermined an important part of its export by making deals with Saudi Arabia to increase their oil production. And its military was a huge part of their economic problems - it spent more than 20% of its gross domestic product on military, rather than development, which was far more than the western countries during the cold war as far as I know.

I would say Capitalism has no chance in the long run, because it has no way to plan for the long run, when everything is based on corporations' short term impulses for profit. It will ruin the environment it relies on, like bacteria consuming an isolated apple. Blind exponential growth until the point where it runs out of something to consume, and then collapse.
And profit doesn't always equate to something which is actually beneficial to society, the people or the economy. You can see that every single day in your life - the spambots on this forum trying to trick people into buying probably non-existant products, the Coca Cola, alcohol and burgers people fill themselves with and the tobacco they smoke, costing immense amounts of money for the healthcare system, I could go on...

A planned economy can exactly take the future into account, because it's planned on the big scale.

Communism is the future. One day machines and computers can, and hopefully wil, do all of our work, and not distributing everything equally would be completely ridiculous at that point.

I don't have time to write anymore today. :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: deoxy99 on November 16, 2011, 01:54:45 PM
Too long; didn't read. :P

Thankfully you didn't have time to right more, you'd probably post something three times the size of what you wrote. :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: smjjames on November 16, 2011, 02:40:20 PM
I think modern capitalism (as we know it and define it) started in the later 19th century while communism/socialism as it's define now probably really began to take on its modern form in the late 19th/early 20th century (Karl Marx and Lenins time), so the modern concepts are relatively young on the timescale of civilization, but yea...

Also, part of the Soviet Unions problem is that they were pretty oppressive and China is definetly to a lesser extent, so I'm not really sure if there can be a communist/socialist economy without getting an oppressive goverment.

I'm not being a defender of capitalism as I agree that there are major problems with the corporations, especially banks and capitalism is certainly a percentage of the cause of the current issues with the global economy (a great deal of it is due to politics though....).
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: matty406 on November 16, 2011, 02:53:42 PM
I've head a lot of bills and acts about copyright and I find them all depressing.
But isn't Youtube just a glorified version of "word-of-mouth"? Surely, you're using Youtube to describe a game to someone, but with a different medium. How about arresting me for telling people what I did in Skyrim today?
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on November 16, 2011, 05:06:47 PM
Hah, very interesting view. Totally agreed.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 17, 2011, 10:38:02 AM
Also, part of the Soviet Unions problem is that they were pretty oppressive and China is definetly to a lesser extent, so I'm not really sure if there can be a communist/socialist economy without getting an oppressive goverment.
True. However, some of Europe is probably more hybrid than China, Denmark has one of the highest tax rates in the world for example (if not the highest). And their governments could hardly be called oppressive from a western point of view. And again, many capitalist governments are also very oppressive, like the extremely conservative ones in the Middle East. And capitalism must accept the oppression which money is bound to cause as well.
I think the power struggles in the early Soviet Union between not only the Bolsheviks and Mensheviks, but also other revolutionary Socialists like the Socialists Revolutionaries. When they received 40% of the votes in 1917 and the Bolsheviks only received 24%, the Bolsheviks then made the wrong move to try taking all control for themselves. I don't think you can blame Socialism for the oppressive rule which came after, maybe the chaos created by an armed revolution could play a role (however, I think the revolution was more than justified against the probably even more oppressive rule which came before it).
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on November 23, 2011, 05:33:04 PM
http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/ (http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/)
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 23, 2011, 10:58:33 PM
http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/ (http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/)
But I have already saved it! :P
Dun dun dun.

http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?cl=1392740568 (http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?cl=1392740568)
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on November 24, 2011, 12:11:05 AM
Oh lol, fail on my part.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: vh on November 24, 2011, 06:05:32 AM
SAVE EET TTWICE!
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 29, 2011, 11:48:37 PM
I got e-mail:

Incredible -- 800,000 signers in days, Congress is hesitating, and one Senator will block the vote by reading out our petition for hours!! Let's get to 1 million - forward this email to everyone --

Dear Friends,

Right now, Congress is debating a law that would give them the power to censor the world's Internet -- creating a blacklist that could target YouTube, WikiLeaks and even groups like Avaaz!

Under the new law, the US could force Internet providers to block any website on suspicion of violating copyright or trademark legislation, or even failing to sufficiently police their users' activities. And, because so much of the Internet's hosts and hardware are located in the US, their blacklist would clamp down on the free web for all of us.

The vote could happen at any time now, but we can help stop this -- champions in Congress want to preserve free speech and tell us that a global outcry would strengthen their hand, and one of them -- Senator Wyden -- says he will "filibuster" or block any vote on the bill by reading out our petition names until the clock runs out! Let's urgently raise our voices from every corner of the world to build an unprecedented global petition. Click below to sign and then forward to everyone:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?vl (http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?vl)

For years, the US has condemned countries like China and Iran for their clampdown on Internet use. But now, the impact of these new censorship laws could be far worse -- effectively blocking sites to every Internet user across the globe.

Last year, a similar Internet censorship bill was killed before reaching the US Senate floor, but it's now back in a different form. Copyright laws already exist and are enforced by courts. But this new law goes much further -- granting the US government and big corporations enormous powers to force service providers and search engines to block websites based just on allegations of violations -- without a trial or being found guilty of any crime!

Free speech advocates have already raised the alarm, and some key senators are trying to gather enough support to stop this dangerous bill. We have no time to lose. Let's stand with them to ensure that American lawmakers preserve the right to a free and open Internet as an essential way for people around the world to exchange ideas, share communication and work collectively to build the world we want. Sign below to stop censorship, and save the Internet as we know it:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?vl (http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_internet/?vl)

In the past months, from the Arab Spring to the global Occupy Movement, we've seen first hand how the Internet can galvanize, unify and change society. Now, if we stand together, we can stop this new attack on Internet freedom. We've done it before -- in Brazil and Italy, Avaaz members have won major victories in the fight for a free Internet. Let's galvanize our global web community to crush the most powerful censorship threat that the Internet has ever seen.

With hope,

Luis, Dalia, Diego, Emma, Ricken, Aaron, Antonia, Benjamin and the rest of the Avaaz team

Sources Op-Ed: Blacklist Bill allows Feds to remove websites from Internet (Digital Journal)
http://digitaljournal.com/article/313463 (http://digitaljournal.com/article/313463)

Disastrous IP Legislation Is Back – And It's Worse than Ever (EFF)
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/10/disastrous-ip-legislation-back-%E2%80%93-and-it%E2%80%99s-worse-ever (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/10/disastrous-ip-legislation-back-%E2%80%93-and-it%E2%80%99s-worse-ever)

Silicon Valley legislators oppose online piracy act (SFGate)
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/11/15/BUO81LV0KI.DTL (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/11/15/BUO81LV0KI.DTL)

House Hearing on Stop Online Piracy Act Scheduled (PC World)
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/243659/house_hearing_on_stop_online_piracy_act_scheduled.html (http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/243659/house_hearing_on_stop_online_piracy_act_scheduled.html)

Growing Chorus of Opposition to "Stop Online Piracy Act"
https://www.cdt.org/report/growing-chorus-opposition-stop-online-piracy-act (https://www.cdt.org/report/growing-chorus-opposition-stop-online-piracy-act)

The stop online piracy act: summary, problems, and implications
https://www.cdt.org/files/pdfs/SOPA%202-pager%20final.pdf (https://www.cdt.org/files/pdfs/SOPA%202-pager%20final.pdf)

Why Is Justin Bieber So Pissed Off?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/timothy-karr/why-is-justin-bieber-so-p_b_1071055.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/timothy-karr/why-is-justin-bieber-so-p_b_1071055.html)

Stop Online Piracy Act
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr3261ih/pdf/BILLS-112hr3261ih.pdf (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr3261ih/pdf/BILLS-112hr3261ih.pdf)

PROTECT IP Act
http://leahy.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/BillText-PROTECTIPAct.pdf (http://leahy.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/BillText-PROTECTIPAct.pdf)
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: FiahOwl on November 30, 2011, 06:58:04 AM

This message is only viewable with Universe Sandbox Galaxy Edition. Access it and much more with promo-code '48055'.

Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 30, 2011, 08:15:37 AM
Pirating is capitalism's fault. Just make everything open source, give people credit for their work and give everyone equal amounts of material stuff so they don't have to rely on people not pirating their stuff to avoid starving to death (okay, that's not the case for the massive corporations, which really just want more money to expand to get even more money to make a colony on Mars, so they can conquer Pluto and then TAKE OVER EARTH and get more money) and as a result want to put ristrictions on the internet.
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: deoxy99 on November 30, 2011, 12:05:00 PM
I don't think pirating is illegal, but that's just me. The person who made the torrent should go to jail for putting it up. :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: Bla on November 30, 2011, 12:21:23 PM
I don't think pirating is illegal, but that's just me. The person who made the torrent should go to jail for putting it up. :P
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement_of_software (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement_of_software)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement)

I don't pirate stuff, but I am very much against copyright laws, just as much as the current system which makes them neccesary. I don't feel sorry for massive companies and rich people, but there are also people who rely on their software sales to pay for their normal house etc., and I think it's wrong to pirate their software.

I'm always scared of being jailed and having to pay 3000 trillion money units for having done SOMETHING wrong copyrightwise somewhen. I mean, almost all software has ridiculously long terms of agreement which nobody could possibly have the time to read, kol, if I read them for all of my games, I could spend the rest of my life on that and never get to actually play them.
But then again, the leader (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johanne_Schmidt-Nielsen) of The Unity List has no intentions to stop pirating music in protest, so I probably shouldn't be that afraid, kolkolkol. :P
Title: Re: Bill S. 978 - About Copyright
Post by: atomic7732 on November 30, 2011, 03:32:53 PM
Well someone wrote them, so it can't take THAT long to read. What are they giving us, 1950 technology games?