Universe Sandbox

Universe Sandbox Legacy => Universe Sandbox 2008 | Discussion => Topic started by: Magnetar on August 10, 2009, 04:43:46 PM

Title: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 10, 2009, 04:43:46 PM
Hi.
I'm making some general suggestions towards improving US.
I'll put the most promising ones at the top and the insane ones in the bottom.

Space Friction:
Some sort of friction mode which decelerates moving objects.

Speed Based Space Friction:
A more complex friction mode which only decelerate objects which are above certain speed. This way the user can controll actually the speeds of his objects in his system.

Active Vector Drawning:
As alternative or addition to "Drag & Drop Movement" I thought of active vector drawning. The user selects his object and holds M1. What he now does, while he holds M1, is drawning a vector line in a XY plane, starting from his object. As soon as he releases M1, he will automatically have the end point of the vector selected. By moving his mouse he will now alternate the height (Z axis) of the end point. As soon has he presses M1 again the height of the end point will be set. The velocity vector is now finished and the object will be set instantly into motion.

Drag & Drop Movement:
Moving and putting objects into motion in RT by dragging them and dropping them in space (some how). Based on the mouse velocity until the drop event a speed will be assigned to the object which was dragged. I don't know how this could be realised in 3D in a good way. But maybe with a work plane.

Single Object Tracing:
This just means, that you select a single object and turn on that it make a trace just for itself. I think this would be especially good for a better performance of US.

Selectable Lagrange Points:
By making Lagrange Points selectable points, just in a way like objects are selectable, users could easily make trojans.

Energetic Colour Mode:
A colour mode showing which kind of energy of an object is higher.
For example: Blue means that the potential energy is higher, red means the kinetic energy is higher. Pink means, that potential and kinetic energy are almost equal.

Custom Coloured Background:
Basically just allow the user to choose a custom background colour.

Fixable Objects:
Basically this would be a tool which would allow you to make masses fixed in your 3D space.
That way they wouldn't be influenced in movement by the gravity of other objects, but however would still pull other objects.

Object breakup on tidal forces:
An option which makes objects brake upon a defined amount of tidal forces. The amount and the masses of the objects into which the object breaks apart could be totally random, or one value could be predefined. The possible configurations would be:
A) Amount X, Mass Random => Creates upon breakup X objects with random masses
B) Amount X, Mass Equal => Creates upon breakup X objects with equal masses.  
C) Amount Random, Mass Equal => Creates upon breakup a random amount of objects with equal masses.
D) Amount Random, Mass Random => Creates upon breakup a random amount of objects with random masses.

Fully Customizable Rings:
A function which allows the user, to make his own planetary rings by setting two distances from the selected mass. The first distance describes at which distance the ring begins, the second distance describes at which distance the ring ends. Before the user is done with making his ring, he still can adjust the density of it. The function could also be made more complex and customizable by also allowing the user to modify the angles at which the ring aligns to the planet.

System Center as a Visible Point:
The System Center as visible and moving point in space. It might be also good if it might be selectable.

No Shadows Mode:
Planets are sometimes hardly visible and can only be guessed with the highlight function, even if visual glowing mode is already turned on. A mode which deactivates shadow or the shadow layer might be helping.

Coloured Objects:
Instead of textures the user could be able simply to colour his object. That way the player could use US easier on a analytical level. By giving objects with certain purposes certain colours.

Friction through Particle Consumption:[/i]
This idea is based upon the idea of simulating solid objects moving through gas clouds and rings. The title already explains the idea pretty well. Basically everytime a moving object is hit by a particle it gets slowed down. To allow the user how strong objects are slowed down, I think a simple slider in the settings would be enough.

Spherical Light Pulse:[/i]
An alternative light pulse mode which spawns a particles ordered in the shape of a sphere instead of a circle.

Additional Camera Functions:
I'm actually being inspired by Celestia for this. It might be interesting to be able to make the camera parented to a an object, capable of being tilt, synchronized to the rotation of an object, as well as centered on a selected object. However since these would be just camera functions, they wouldn't have any other practical use than adding new possibilites of making screenshots, videos or just looking around.

Trail Styles:
Different styles of trails. For example: A dotted and dashed line, as well as a simple version of the line which has no fading out effects and just ends and starts and maybe a general capability to use customizable trail sprites.

2D Trails:
As I understand the current trail mode objects set points after a predefined timer interval, which then basically create lines. This way the trails can be observed in 3D. However they eat up quite a lot of performance. 2D trails instead would be simple 2D trails, which simply work by letting objects painting the pixels over which they move. They are 2D, meaining that they will be removed as soon as you move your camera, but they are a lot of more performance efficient and could be used for longtime simulations in which you would be simply interested into how orbits will turn out after an X amount of time.

Statistical Tools:
Some statistical tools would be interesting. For example graphs showing stuff like Mass-Velocity, Mass-n-Bodies, etc. It doesn't have to be line graphs, I think simple bar charts would also already do the job, calculating the total mass in the system and dividing the masses in about 10 - 20 categories.

The Event Log:
I suggest to introduce a simple event log, which simply logs objects collisions and mergings, as well as the time of the events. This would especailly help the user of keeping track of the events happening in large scaled systems.

Gravity Mapping:
The very interesting thing about the 2D grid is that it shows in acceleration mode during the first seconds a gravity map of all massy objects. You can even see the low gravity zones in which some of the lagrange points are situated It might be really interesting to introduce some sort of fixed and improved version of that 2D grid for gravity mapping. Picture (http://i28.tinypic.com/2niz4w7.png). The little yellow dot between the Earth and Moon is actually where L1 is situated. Thinking about including it, I think the first and simplest way would be simple to introduce a slice of very dense ordered but fixed particles. Like the current 2D grid. However it could be selected and simply moved around the dimension. Or rotated. A bit like the slicing function in this demonstration of the magnetic force: http://www.falstad.com/vector3dm/

Wrapped Space:
If you think of space as a giant 4D ball (which it probably is) you will go back to the same position when you just go straight into the same direction. Basically, this could means for you that your objects won't just disappear in the space, but just come out at the other side of the space again.

The Probe:
Probably the craziest feature I'm suggesting. The probe would be basically an object whose movement can be controlled with a couple of keys on your keyboard (numpad keys would be probably the best). The movement would start instantly when the key is pressed, with no acceleration phase. The user however would be able to set it's speed in the settings, so he can choose a suitable velocity for different solar systems. The probe would also be able able to draw a trail in space, when enabled. Now we come to the interesting and helpful way the probe could be used: Like all other objects the probe would be affected by gravity. This means the user is capable of studying how speed influences the orbit of real probes. He would also be able to perform slingshot maneuvers and a simple level and all the other basic stuff which space agencies are doing with their probes and space vehicles.

Dynamic Masses / Gravity Waves:
This is probably my craziest idea. But I think that it might be interesting, if masses could dynamically vary with different frequencies based on classic sine waves. This way the user would be able to create gravity waves in US, effecting the orbits of various objects in a very different way.

Note:
I might make some mock-up interface and stuff to certain suggestions again.

Suggestions made by other Forum Members:

Eclipse Mode (Naru523):
It show shadows, example like Saturn's Ring, it is black due to Saturn's Shadow, and the Moon eclipsing the Sun, making the Earth a bit blocked.

Debris Setting (Chaotic Cow):
A toggle or number option on how long Debris from colliding bodies last.
This option will be useful for people who want to create rings and stuff by collisions and not manually.

Various 2D & 3D graph modes (FGFG)::
FGFG basically suggests a mode which tracks velocity, acceleration, distance (and maybe mass?) and shows these in 2D and 3D graphs. Original Post: Click Here (http://universesandbox.com/forum/index.php/topic,628.msg6981.html#msg6981)

Particle consumption: (Bla)
When one of the massless particles you can make in US hits a massive body, it could add X mass to the body. The extra mass could be determined by a slider.

Protobodies: (Bla)
When you make objects like rings, there could be an option to make a (small) percentage of the particles into small bodies with mass. With the particle consumption idea above, the rings could form small bodies and in protoplanetary discs they could also form small bodies that could perhaps end up as protoplanets. Whee.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on August 10, 2009, 04:50:30 PM
Space Friction:
Some sort of friction mode which decelerates moving objects.

Kind of like in an accretion disk?
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 10, 2009, 04:53:50 PM
Space Friction:
Some sort of friction mode which decelerates moving objects.

Kind of like in an accretion disk?

Not  that way. Just friction effecting all objects which are moving in your virtual space / room.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 10, 2009, 05:05:39 PM
I like these ideas. Though no need for wrapped space as I never seem to do anything that big to need it to be...wrapped.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on August 10, 2009, 08:20:44 PM
Space Friction:
Some sort of friction mode which decelerates moving objects.

Speed Based Space Friction:
A more complex friction mode which only decelerate objects which are above certain speed. This way the user can controll actually the speeds of his objects in his system.

Active Vector Drawning:
As alternative or addition to "Drag & Drop Movement" I thought of active vector drawning. The user selects his object and holds M1. What he now does, while he holds M1, is drawning a vector line in a XY plane, starting from his object. As soon as he releases M1, he will automatically have the end point of the vector selected. By moving his mouse he will now alternate the height (Z axis) of the end point. As soon has he presses M1 again the height of the end point will be set. The velocity vector is now finished and the object will be set instantly into motion.

Drag & Drop Movement:
Moving and putting objects into motion in RT by dragging them and dropping them in space (some how). Based on the mouse velocity until the drop event a speed will be assigned to the object which was dragged. I don't know how this could be realised in 3D in a good way. But maybe with a work plane.

Single Object Tracing:
This just means, that you select a single object and turn on that it make a trace just for itself. I think this would be especially good for a better performance of US.

Energetic Colour Mode:
A colour mode showing which kind of energy of an object is higher.
For example: Blue means that the potential energy is higher, red means the kinetic energy is higher. Pink means, that potential and kinetic energy are almost equal.

Statistical Tools:
Some statistical tools would be interesting. For example graphs showing stuff like Mass-Velocity, Mass-n-Bodies, etc. It doesn't have to be line graphs, I think simple bar charts would also already do the job, calculating the total mass in the system and dividing the masses in about 10 - 20 categories.

Wrapped Space:
If you think of space as a giant 4D ball (which it probably is) you will go back to the same position when you just go straight into the same direction. Basically, this could means for you that your objects won't just disappear in the space, but just come out at the other side of the space again.

Dynamic Masses / Gravity Waves:
This is probably my craziest idea. But I think that it might be interesting, if masses could dynamically vary with different frequencies based on classic sine waves. This way the user would be able to create gravity waves in US, effecting the orbits of various objects in a very different way.

Note:
I might make some mock-up interface and stuff to certain suggestions again.
Our Solar System - All Known Comets :: Idea by Chaotic Cow
It shows all the comets orbiting the Sun. Thank CC for the idea.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on August 10, 2009, 11:21:05 PM
Wow... These are great and some of them would be pretty easy to implement.

I feel comfortable promising Energetic Colour Mode & Space Friction in the next release.

And it's possible Single Object Tracing (Trails) will also show up. (maybe)

Chart mode is a major area I'm focusing on improving and your Statistical Tool idea is definitely influential.

And I plan on adding something with similar results to your Active Vector Drawing suggestion.

I like the idea of drag & drop movement... That would be cool

Awesome ideas. Keep them coming.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 11, 2009, 10:00:45 AM
That's very great Dan. :)

Anyways, I added some more stuff into the list:

Selectable Lagrange Points:
By making Lagrange Points selectable points, just in a way like objects are selectable, users could easily make trojans.

Custom Coloured Background:
Basically just allow the user to choose a custom background colour.

System Center as a Visible Point:
The System Center as visible and moving point in space. It might be also good if it might be selectable.

No Shadows Mode:
Planets are sometimes hardly visible and can only be guessed with the highlight function, even if visual glowing mode is already turned on. A mode which deactivates shadow or the shadow layer might be helping.

Coloured Objects:
Instead of textures the user could be able simply to colour his object. That way the player could use US easier on an analytical level. By giving objects with certain purposes certain colours.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on August 11, 2009, 03:21:42 PM
No Shadows Mode:
Planets are sometimes hardly visible and can only be guessed with the highlight function, even if visual glowing mode is already turned on. A mode which deactivates shadow or the shadow layer might be helping.
I forgot to tell Dan about this soo...
Eclipse Mode
It show shadows, example like Saturn's Ring, it is black due to Saturn's Shadow, and the Moon eclipsing the Sun, making the Earth a bit blocked.

Coloured Objects:
Instead of textures the user could be able simply to colour his object. That way the player could use US easier on an analytical level. By giving objects with certain purposes certain colours.
Dan already got this working.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on August 11, 2009, 03:42:13 PM
Eclipse mode should be like, default.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 11, 2009, 03:47:32 PM
Yes. The Comet idea was brilliant. :D *Showoff*

But I like the no shadows and eclipse mode!
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on August 11, 2009, 03:49:06 PM
Yes. The Comet idea was brilliant. :D *Showoff*

i don't see it  ??? *confused and confuzzled*
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 11, 2009, 03:50:55 PM
I posted it in the Solar Hurricane thread.


http://universesandbox.com/forum/index.php/topic,617.msg5100.html#msg5100
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 20, 2009, 08:23:02 AM
I think Eclipse mode aka dynamic lightning might make some trouble with US. It would probably have a huge impact on the performance of US. But there might be some way to work around. For example a texture layer could be projected over planets, which is basically black, but has a transparency gradient from full transparency to no transparency. All which would happen to the texture now would be, that the full transparent side is always scrolled in a way so that it directly faces the object which is supposed to be the light source. It would be a fake dynamic lightening, meaning that objects wouldn't throw shadows on other objects, but always having a shadow side oppossing a side where the planet is illuminated and the surface could be seen lighted up because of the high transperancy.

A new idea of mine:
Fixable Objects:
Basically this would be a tool which would allow you to make masses fixed in your 3D space.
That way they wouldn't be influenced in movement by the gravity of other objects, but however would still pull other objects.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on August 20, 2009, 10:49:34 AM
Aww... :P
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on August 23, 2009, 06:16:43 AM
A new idea of mine:
Fixable Objects:
Basically this would be a tool which would allow you to make masses fixed in your 3D space.
That way they wouldn't be influenced in movement by the gravity of other objects, but however would still pull other objects.

This is on the list for version 2. :)

Quote
Eclipse mode
This is on my long term wish list.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 26, 2009, 10:04:24 AM
A new idea of mine:
Fixable Objects:
Basically this would be a tool which would allow you to make masses fixed in your 3D space.
That way they wouldn't be influenced in movement by the gravity of other objects, but however would still pull other objects.

This is on the list for version 2. :)

Thank you. That's very great. :)
It will be very interesting feature and I predict that a whole new way of using the gravity simulation ability of Universe Sandbox will come into existance. I predict that users will make objects of different masses fixed in space and then play some gravitational pinball by throwing in a non-fixed object into the system.

Anyways, another idea for product improvement:

Fully Customizable Rings:
A function which allows the user, to make his own planetary rings by setting two distances from the selected mass. The first distance describes at which distance the ring begins, the second distance describes at which distance the ring ends. Before the user is done with making his ring, he still can adjust the density of it. The function could also be made more complex and customizable by also allowing the user to modify the angles at which the ring aligns to the planet.

The Probe:
Probably the craziest feature I'm suggesting. The probe would be basically an object whose movement can be controlled with a couple of keys on your keyboard (numpad keys would be probably the best). The movement would start instantly when the key is pressed, with no acceleration phase. The user however would be able to set it's speed in the settings, so he can choose a suitable velocity for different solar systems. The probe would also be able able to draw a trail in space, when enabled. Now we come to the interesting and helpful way the probe could be used: Like all other objects the probe would be affected by gravity. This means the user is capable of studying how speed influences the orbit of real probes. He would also be able to perform slingshot maneuvers and a simple level and all the other basic stuff which space agencies are doing with their probes and space vehicles.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 26, 2009, 10:09:30 AM
Debris Setting

A toggle or number option on how long Debris from colliding bodies last.
This option will be useful for people who want to create rings and stuff by collisions and not manually.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 28, 2009, 09:08:38 AM
Huh, didn't expected that you guys start to place your suggestion into my thread.  ???
Anyways, some more suggestions from me:

Object breakup on tidal forces:
An option which makes objects brake upon a defined amount of tidal forces. The amount and the masses of the objects into which the object breaks apart could be totally random, or one value could be predefined. The possible configurations would be:
A) Amount X, Mass Random => Creates upon breakup X objects with random masses
B) Amount X, Mass Equal => Creates upon breakup X objects with equal masses.  
C) Amount Random, Mass Equal => Creates upon breakup a random amount of objects with equal masses.
D) Amount Random, Mass Random => Creates upon breakup a random amount of objects with random masses.

Trail Styles:
Different styles of trails. For example: A dotted and dashed line, as well as a simple version of the line which has no fading out effects and just ends and starts and maybe a general capability to use customizable trail sprites.

2D Trails:
As I understand the current trail mode objects set points after a predefined timer interval, which then basically create lines. This way the trails can be observed in 3D. However they eat up quite a lot of performance. 2D trails instead would be simple 2D trails, which simply work by letting objects painting the pixels over which they move. They are 2D, meaining that they will be removed as soon as you move your camera, but they are a lot of more performance efficient and could be used for longtime simulations in which you would be simply interested into how orbits will turn out after an X amount of time.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Bla on August 28, 2009, 11:02:38 AM
Huh, didn't expected that you guys start to place your suggestion into my thread.  ???
Since the title was very neutral, I thought it'd be better to post in here instead of making a new thread called "Another Couple of Suggestions". :)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on August 28, 2009, 03:42:11 PM
Huh, didn't expected that you guys start to place your suggestion into my thread.  ???

I'd take it as a compliment. It's good to be part of a great thread.


Object breakup on tidal forces:

This is a complicated one, but something I look forward to addressing after I release the major UI improvements in version 2.0

Trail Styles

Other than just personal preference, I'm not sure how useful this feature would be. It's a good idea, but I'm not sure that the amount of work to implement would be worth the reward.

2D Trails

Trails do eat up lots of performance. I'm going to add a toggle for trails to use lines instead of actual 3D geometry. This should give the performance boost you seek.


Wow. More great ideas... Keep them coming!
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 28, 2009, 04:05:06 PM
Of course Dan you can always just work on the other things little by little.

That way even though you are only doing a little at a time..you will eventually finish it.

Example the Trail Styles.  Though nothing major it would be cool to have this and would be really neat with long trails and making neat trail creations.

Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on August 31, 2009, 02:25:10 AM
Since the title was very neutral, I thought it'd be better to post in here instead of making a new thread called "Another Couple of Suggestions". :)

I think it's fine as long as the suggestions don't get too funky (which I honestly somehow expect when I'm looking at the average user age here; no offense). Anyways, I'll add all the good suggestions into the first post of this thread. ;)

Trail Styles
Other than just personal preference, I'm not sure how useful this feature would be. It's a good idea, but I'm not sure that the amount of work to implement would be worth the reward.

Well there would be a little advantage with dotted lines. Unlike continuos lines they wouldn't overlap that easily. But I also think this feature is not really that important for the next versions of US.  But it might be a good feature for later versions of US with also an interface for customization which could allow users to load their self-made trail textures.

2D Trails
Trails do eat up lots of performance. I'm going to add a toggle for trails to use lines instead of actual 3D geometry. This should give the performance boost you seek.

That's great. :)

Wow. More great ideas... Keep them coming!

I think I'm slowly running out of them. :D
Anyways, I'll continue posting any useful idea I can think of in this thread. ;)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 31, 2009, 08:52:51 PM
I also would like US to save 2D Grid Dust stuff.

As of now if you save it doesn't save it.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on August 31, 2009, 08:58:51 PM
I also would like US to save 2D Grid Dust stuff.

Save needs quite a bit of work. Dust doesn't save nor does trail data.

What I really need to get working is full state saves. This would open up the possibility of an undo feature. :)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on August 31, 2009, 09:47:18 PM
I also would like US to save 2D Grid Dust stuff.

Save needs quite a bit of work. Dust doesn't save nor does trail data.

What I really need to get working is full state saves. This would open up the possibility of an undo feature. :)

Perfect. Should we expect it in US v2.0 or later version?
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 01, 2009, 11:02:10 AM
One thing which maybe should be changed:
I think the color range for the Velocity and Acceleration color mode should be flipped.
As far I know violet-blue colours are mostly used to indicate when something is high, while red-yellow colours indicate when something is low.

I also noticed that US calculates Lagrange points for massless objects.

Edit: And there goes another feature suggestion:  ;D

Timed Screenshots:
Basically a mode which automatically shots a screenshot after X seconds of time.
This would be especially useful to take footage of long time and high performance simulations.
The single screenshots could be also later just merged together to a single video using 3rd party video software.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on September 01, 2009, 08:40:27 PM
SuperNova's Timed Impact Idea and discussion moved here:
http://universesandbox.com/forum/index.php/topic,755.0.html
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Bla on September 01, 2009, 10:42:14 PM
I think the color ranges for velocity and acceleration is right. Slow/weak/etc. things should be red, because it has the longest wavelength, and fast/powerful/etc. things should be blue, because it has the shortest wavelength.
But I also want the color on faucets(?) swapped. :P
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on September 01, 2009, 11:07:05 PM
I think the color range for the Velocity and Acceleration color mode should be flipped.
As far I know violet-blue colours are mostly used to indicate when something is high, while red-yellow colours indicate when something is low.

I think of red as fast and blue as slow... But I can imagine that this is not the standard. Can anyone find examples where color is used to show speed?

Here's an example where red is high:
http://mappery.com/map-name/Printable-World-Map-Elevation-Wik

Here's an example where blue is high:
http://mappery.com/map-name/Digital-Elevation-Map-of-Lunar-South-Pole

Timed Screenshots

Universe Sandbox does this already, but it's not at all clear. If you right click, next to the movie button is a text box, this number is how frequently (in frames) to take a screenshot. If you set it to 1 then movie mode takes a screenshot every frame. Would you prefer that this was not frames, but simulation time?

I think the color ranges for velocity and acceleration is right.

So you mean the opposite of how it is now in Universe Sandbox?
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on September 01, 2009, 11:35:27 PM
Of course you can always make a "Velocity - Inverted" and "Acceleration - Inverted" option.

Everybody loves options. :D
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: FGFG on September 02, 2009, 04:26:27 AM
If you decide to make trails multicolored according to the velocity and acceleration changes, it would be pretty easy to show these data in the chart mode. Maybe this way:

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk114/FGFG-23/GraficoUniverseSandbox.jpg)

Let's explain:

The graph is composed by the bodies in the simulation and by normal trails disposed according to different data.

"Focus on": If you select for example the Sun all the trails will become the graph of the acceleration/velocity/distance from the Sun. The Sun will be locked on zero.

The "dimension" value will take you back to the normal chart mode, with the direct comparison of the objects.

The brown object is the result of the collision between the green and pink planet. After the collision the planets collided will remain in that position to let the user see the original objects.

It would be nice if the time and the other values could be scaled both automatically (like the actual time step indicator) and manually.

The time is basically the time needed to the trails to disappear, so if you increase the number of trail segments the graph would be longer.

It would be nice if the simulation could run in background so that you can see the evolution of the graph in real (= simulated) time.

Lastly it would be even nicer if you could make a 3d graph showing 2 values at the same time, like this:

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk114/FGFG-23/GraficoUniverseSandbox3d.jpg)

Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on September 02, 2009, 07:49:54 AM
Hmmm... I like it!  ;D ;D ;D

Although, I don't see where the pink planet is.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: FGFG on September 02, 2009, 08:37:48 AM
violet ;)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 02, 2009, 10:53:33 AM
I think the color range for the Velocity and Acceleration color mode should be flipped.
As far I know violet-blue colours are mostly used to indicate when something is high, while red-yellow colours indicate when something is low.

I think of red as fast and blue as slow... But I can imagine that this is not the standard. Can anyone find examples where color is used to show speed?

Here's an example where red is high:
http://mappery.com/map-name/Printable-World-Map-Elevation-Wik

Here's an example where blue is high:
http://mappery.com/map-name/Digital-Elevation-Map-of-Lunar-South-Pole

I think the first map might be based upon height data created by radiographic measurement of the earth. This would means that the surface parts who are close to the satellite (mountains) are coloured red and the rather distant parts blue. The second map looks rather demonstrational since it has a 0 point colour defined.

However I'm not entirely sure about the colour controversy. I think I've seen a lot of maps based upon radio data which used blue / violet as colour to indicate maxima.  But it might be that researchers just choose the way the color range goes after their personal preference.


Timed Screenshots

Universe Sandbox does this already, but it's not at all clear. If you right click, next to the movie button is a text box, this number is how frequently (in frames) to take a screenshot. If you set it to 1 then movie mode takes a screenshot every frame. Would you prefer that this was not frames, but simulation time?

But this only describes how much frames should be saved as screenshots per second, right?
What I'm rather thinking of is letting US take one screenshot after every 60 or 30 seconds, or any user wanted time intervall.

If you decide to make trails multicolored according to the velocity and acceleration changes, it would be pretty easy to show these data in the chart mode. Maybe this way:

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk114/FGFG-23/GraficoUniverseSandbox.jpg (http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk114/FGFG-23/GraficoUniverseSandbox.jpg)

Wow I love your idea. However Dan, if you consider adding any time based stats tracking similiar to this also add an option to disable. I do suspect that I might cost a lot of performance in large system.

And some feature suggestions again:

The Event Log:
I suggest to introduce a simple event log, which simply logs objects collisions and mergings, as well as the time of the events. This would especailly help the user of keeping track of the events happening in large scaled systems.

Gravity Mapping:
The very interesting thing about the 2D grid is that it shows in acceleration mode during the first seconds a gravity map of all massy objects. You can even see the low gravity zones in which some of the lagrange points are situated It might be really interesting to introduce some sort of fixed and improved version of that 2D grid for gravity mapping.

(http://i28.tinypic.com/2niz4w7.png)
The little yellow dot between the Earth and Moon is actually where L1 is situated.  :)

Thinking about including it, I think the first and simplest way would be simple to introduce a slice of very dense ordered but fixed particles. Like the current 2D grid. However it could be selected and simply moved around the dimension. Or rotated.

A bit like the slicing function in this demonstration of the magnetic force:
http://www.falstad.com/vector3dm/
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: FGFG on September 02, 2009, 03:16:36 PM
But this only describes how much frames should be saved as screenshots per second, right?
What I'm rather thinking of is letting US take one screenshot after every 60 or 30 seconds, or any user wanted time intervall.

The number is the number of frames that are calculated before the screenshot is taken.
If you set 1 every frame is a screenshot
If you set 5 there is a screenshot every 5 frames
...
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on September 02, 2009, 04:35:04 PM
I like the gravity mapping idea!

I thought this would be cool to show with a grid effect too!
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 03, 2009, 04:21:07 AM
Thinking about including it, I think the first and simplest way would be simple to introduce a slice of very dense ordered but fixed particles. Like the current 2D grid. However it could be selected and simply moved around the dimension. Or rotated.

A bit like the slicing function in this demonstration of the magnetic force:
http://www.falstad.com/vector3dm/
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 11, 2009, 01:11:45 PM
Universe Sandbox does this already, but it's not at all clear. If you right click, next to the movie button is a text box, this number is how frequently (in frames) to take a screenshot. If you set it to 1 then movie mode takes a screenshot every frame. Would you prefer that this was not frames, but simulation time?

Ok, I didn't knew that the movie mode was working the way FGFG described it.
I think it's fine how it currenlty is. So there is no need for sceen caps based on simulation time.

And a few new ideas again:

Friction through Particle Consumption:
This idea is based upon the idea of simulating solid objects moving through gas clouds and rings. The title already explains the idea pretty well. Basically everytime a moving object is hit by a particle it gets slowed down. To allow the user how strong objects are slowed down, I think a simple slider in the settings would be enough.

Spherical Light Pulse:
An alternative light pulse mode which spawns a particles ordered in the shape of a sphere instead of a circle.

Additional Camera Functions:
I'm actually being inspired by Celestia for this. It might be interesting to be able to make the camera parented to a an object, capable of being tilt, synchronized to the rotation of an object, as well as centered on a selected object. However since these would be just camera functions, they wouldn't have any other practical use than adding new possibilites of making screenshots, videos or just looking around.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Bla on September 11, 2009, 01:32:56 PM
Your new ideas are great! Reading about the friction through particle consumption, and about the slider below, I got this idea:

Particle consumption:
When one of the massless particles you can make in US hits a massive body, it could add X mass to the body. The extra mass could be determined by a slider.

And

Protobodies:
When you make objects like rings, there could be an option to make a (small) percentage of the particles into small bodies with mass. With the particle consumption idea above, the rings could form small bodies and in protoplanetary discs they could also form small bodies that could perhaps end up as protoplanets. Whee. :)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 16, 2009, 04:26:26 AM
A few ideas, I don't really know if they are useful and if there is interest in it:

No Collisions Mode:  
Collisions between objects are ignored and don't have an impact on the velocities.

Sprite Mode:
The idea behind this is to include a sprite mode. When it's turned on it visually replaces spherical 3D objects with circular sprites of the same size. But I don't know if that mode would make any sense, since the only use for it would be performance improvement, and I can't make an estimation if it would be helping or not.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: FGFG on September 17, 2009, 04:59:10 AM
Sprite Mode

You can already turn bodies off and highlighs on ;)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 17, 2009, 05:09:19 AM
Sprite Mode

You can already turn bodies off and highlighs on ;)

There's a difference to what am I talking about.
The highlight mode is mainly there to help you detecting planets in unclear systems.
Highlight circles also stop to scale down at large distances and also overlap all objects.

I thought of a sprite mode which visualizes planets like particles. As 2D object which can
cover each other,  scale completely down on large distances and are sized according to the radius of the planet.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: monmarfori on September 17, 2009, 05:17:39 AM
Lets try: Galaxy Merge mode
A galaxy collision that can be merged.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on September 17, 2009, 07:21:25 PM
If you decide to make trails multicolored according to the velocity and acceleration changes, it would be pretty easy to show these data in the chart mode. Maybe this way:

Awesome idea. No promises for version 2, but it's on the must do next year list.

I'll write up more commentary and respond to the other ideas in the thread tomorrow.

I've also been experimenting with a new feature that I think everyone's going to love playing with.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on September 18, 2009, 09:15:41 AM
Darn it, Dan. Making us all anxious. xD
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: SuperNova on September 18, 2009, 09:25:45 AM
If you decide to make trails multicolored according to the velocity and acceleration changes, it would be pretty easy to show these data in the chart mode. Maybe this way:

Awesome idea. No promises for version 2, but it's on the must do next year list.

I'll write up more commentary and respond to the other ideas in the thread tomorrow.

I've also been experimenting with a new feature that I think everyone's going to love playing with.

DOMG! DO YOU MEAN THE ''watch everything building up'' UPDATE?!!! OR THE COMET IMPACT UPDATE OR THE miamdoashdisoahdkasd overreacting! nadundtyubdnakdbbshkdiahhndkasndakj overreacting!! maduisnamldanmdsa......overrea......*turned off*
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 18, 2009, 02:17:24 PM
Thanks for all the support everyone.

One of my goals for the next year is to get Universe Sandbox into some schools.

To make it really tasteful for schools I think US would need....

What am I missing from this list?
- Show acceleration vectors of a body
- Show velocity vectors of a body
- Distance measurement between any two bodies
- Gravity field strength view - a fixed grid showing the force of gravity (like the diagram from your other post)
- Global system properties list: # of bodies, total mass, total energy

What do you mean by diagram modes?

It was some years ago as I had access to some content made especially for schools.
As I remember there were semi-dynamic applets, which allowed you to change some stuff.
A lot of things were especially made in a presentational style, almost like an animation.
 
Vectors dynamically scaled according to their absolute values and as I remember there were dynamic diagrams which changed according to the happening on the screen. I do think we already brought up alot of ideas which are very supportive for the use in schools, however there are still some things which might be worth thinking of for the versions after US 2.0. I personally miss some sort of teacher guy in this forum, who would come up with some helping ideas. Anyways, I'll let me try to come up with some stuff:

Dynamic Energy Diagrams:
A bar chart which can be activated for an object and represents two bars showing the kinetic and potential energy in comparison. This would be especially interesting for elliptic orbits. Since the kinetic rises depending from the point of the orbit same for the potential energy.

Gravitational Voltage / Work Diagramm:
Demonstrating which voltage is needed and how much work has to been done to move an object from point A to point B.

Overall I think about opening Work Group threads, in which people thinking about different aspects / goals of US can post their ideas.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: hbmp88 on September 18, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
I wish i was still in physical science...  :'(
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on September 25, 2009, 03:51:12 AM
Two ideas to increase performance in ring and galaxy simulations:

A. Particle Termination Radius:

A radius which can be set to a parent object, which automatically removes every particle which travels across a specified radius. Since this way particles which left the system would be removed while at the the same time the performance of the simulation would be boosted.

B. Particle Termination on Escape Velocity:

As soon as a particle has reached the escape velocity of the system it automatically becomes removed. This basically prevents the existance of particles which won't interact with the system again. However unlike A) this would still allow the existence of particles with a very large orbit.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: bessy on October 02, 2009, 03:06:44 AM
maybe with the predicted path have a bar that makes it the more to the right the more accurate it is and to the left the less

for eg you know how it is now when a object will pass close to another object the prediction line goes all jagged and bad as the points in time it snap shots are only 1 or 2 as the body's are close maybe have it so it will take more snapshots for better accuracy but keep it at the same speed thru time as i have a amd phenom x4 2.5ghz bfg 8800 ultra 8 gig of ram and i only see slow down when there are extreme amounts of particles on screen but even when there are 2 body's id like it to be really accurate but keep it at a fast speed

also I'm looking to upgrade my graphics card to the ATi HD 5870x2  when it comes out will it make any dif to the speed and accuracy of US as it supports physics in games

orbit speed
eg in fig 1

better accuracy control for predicted path
or if you can make it smooth
eg in fig 2


orbit problems in the current version as you may already be aware when click on a body and click orbit parent it only goes in a predetermined way but you may all so know that if you put a object higher or lower along this path the orbit parent doesn't work as it tries to make it go in that direction so if you had it at the simulation top if a object it just falls to the object and doesn't go into orbit

id like it if when you click orbit parent the camera zooms behind the object so the parent is behind it and give you a wheel so you can pick which direction you want it to orbit and it sets the object off in that direction at the exact speed needed for a perfect circular orbit

this feature could be good for ring making as well as that follows the same principle
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on October 10, 2009, 01:28:50 PM
Might be a thing for US 3.0:

Planetary B-Fields & Charged Particle Emitters:

Objects could have a magnetic field. Other celestial objects could be turned into emitters of charged particles, meaning that the interaction of planetary b-fields with solar particle storms could be simulated in their basic appearence.

Selection Box & Multiple Planet Selection:[/b]

Just allow it users to draw selection boxes (with a tool?) and simply allow users select multiple objects by holding shift and clicking on multiple objects.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on October 14, 2009, 03:30:01 PM
I will definitely be improving the accuracy of projected paths in the next version.

Thanks for the diagrams bessy. :)

Selection Box & Multiple Planet Selection:[/b]

And I've been waiting for someone to mention multiple selection of bodies... I've been thinking about it for some time... I'm thinking about it for version 2, but no promises yet.

Planetary B-Fields & Charged Particle Emitters:

That could be interesting. Definitely thinking about it.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: monmarfori on October 17, 2009, 02:51:37 PM
You like Past time instead to go future? it will decrease the date like 10/17/09 to 10/16/09 in a time step of 1 day in 1 second
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on October 18, 2009, 08:18:03 PM
DO YOU MEAN THE ''watch everything building up'' UPDATE?!!!

Do you mean the... ???
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on October 18, 2009, 09:57:33 PM
Hm..?
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atommo999 on October 22, 2009, 09:56:04 AM
how about a timeline so stars turn red giants and go nebulae or supernovae deoending on gtheir masses and eventually become white dwarfs, black dwarfs, neutron stars or black holes. i think a feauteure like this should be optional though because not everyone wants their system to explode!  :D
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on November 07, 2009, 10:32:14 PM
Pulsar Stars

Gases are released on their poles. Shinier then the star.

Black Hole Update

When the object gets "sucked" in, the black hole haves Extragalactic Jet going off at its poles. Also, I just want the black hole in a regular way (meaning that when objects get sucked in, I dont want it to be bigger), and the Accretion disk.



Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on November 07, 2009, 11:39:19 PM
Evolving Life

They are simple and can grow on habitable planets, take off in their ships (once they build up to that level) and explore the solar system.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: SuperNova on November 08, 2009, 07:25:53 AM
Evolving Life

They are simple and can grow on habitable planets, take off in their ships (once they build up to that level) and explore the solar system.

i came up with that too :)
its almost impossible to make, and its realy hard to script/make that.
if it would be in Universe Sandbox 2 or later, it would be awsome!
but its even more harder to simulate a good impact

if you realy want to simulate it, play OMNI IV.
its fun and cool ;D
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on November 08, 2009, 08:10:57 AM
I think monmarfori means is that time steps should be able to go in reverse!

I like the idea.

This would be useful with a Saving system probably.

Be cool to see a collision over and over. :D
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: deoxy99 on November 08, 2009, 11:17:38 AM
Planet Discoverers:

Sends a space probe out to find planets, then goes back to planet where deployed.
Right click planet, push button, they are deployed...comes back to planet where deployed!
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on November 08, 2009, 11:27:42 AM
if you realy want to simulate it, play OMNI IV.

But onmi doesn't have [simple] collisions,  or even things that orbit, if you could put US and Omni together... AWESOME!!

More: Evolving Life

But, I still think just life that is pixels as cities, only large ones, and a spaceship that you and them can actually fly. Since the chances are so small... You can choose to make them larger, and go quicker (not time, just evolution), or to just get spaceships going around to kill or fly yourself there should be a button to just pop it on a habitable planet. If there is none:

Sometimes, make a new planet and it gives you terrestrial planets to chose from, and it asks you to upload or make a new map (new idea), or it pops on the closes terrestrial planet or moon.

Question

Do you have words (like in a box over a button almost anywhere on the computer) pop up when you mouse over a "new object".

Texture Maker
Simple, an in game texture maker. You can see it as a globe and edit, or as a map, and it saves it in some map folder.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on November 08, 2009, 12:07:55 PM
You guys seem to want more of a game then a simulation. lol
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Bla on November 08, 2009, 12:48:20 PM
Yes, I like the texture maker idea though. Just with some basic Paint-like tools deployed, so you can draw the map at a globe. As soon as the map has been drawn as a base it can always be edited in a flat, normal image editor like Photoshop etc.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on November 25, 2009, 02:47:39 PM
Selection Box & Multiple Planet Selection:[/b]
Just allow it users to draw selection boxes (with a tool?) and simply allow users select multiple objects by holding shift and clicking on multiple objects.

I'm working on this right now.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on November 27, 2009, 01:40:08 PM
I did got an idea but I forgot. Darn...
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: deoxy99 on January 10, 2010, 10:16:52 AM
Ultra-Light:

A light that hot enough to burn planets into dust particles.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: JoelM935 on February 16, 2010, 12:49:18 PM
A 3D mode for reald 3D glasses

http://www.reald.com/
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on February 16, 2010, 04:09:41 PM
You can tune the 3d, but... those are almos tthe same color.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: JoelM935 on February 17, 2010, 03:21:49 AM
I tried changing the colour to both white but didn't work
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: SuperNova on February 17, 2010, 04:04:34 AM
Ideas that are impossible but Awesome!
you have a space ship and you can land on a habitable planet, you see real city's, tree's, people. you can take off or land. wen its night, you see the planets in the sky, and when its day you see your sun :) when a planet got destroyed or moved from it habitable place, it burns or gets destroyed. you can land on asteroids to see from the asteroid, or Destroy him before it destroys your planet.

wouldn't that be AWESOME?!
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on February 17, 2010, 11:04:52 AM
Ideas that are impossible but Awesome! ...

I wouldn't call it impossible. If I've discovered anything over the last few years of working on Universe Sandbox it's that nothing is impossible, it just may take a long time. I think my younger self might have called what I've created with Universe Sandbox 2 impossible, but clearly it wasn't.

I agree, the idea is awesome.

Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: JoelM935 on February 19, 2010, 01:56:58 PM
Supernova
When you right click a star you should have the option to make it go supernova and see it's affect on orbiting bodies. Also when stars collide they should go supernova.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: deoxy99 on February 20, 2010, 10:52:34 PM
Supernova
When you right click a star you should have the option to make it go supernova and see it's affect on orbiting bodies. Also when stars collide they should go supernova.
Great idea.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Dan Dixon on February 23, 2010, 10:39:13 PM
Fully Customizable Rings:
A function which allows the user, to make his own planetary rings by setting two distances from the selected mass. The first distance describes at which distance the ring begins, the second distance describes at which distance the ring ends. Before the user is done with making his ring, he still can adjust the density of it. ...

I got this working today. This will be in Universe Sandbox 2.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Chaotic Cow on February 25, 2010, 02:03:32 PM
Supernova
When you right click a star you should have the option to make it go supernova and see it's affect on orbiting bodies. Also when stars collide they should go supernova.
Great Idea! Really!

Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Bla on February 25, 2010, 11:00:05 PM
Yes, the supernova idea is great. It might be hard to make them turn into nebulae however, at least right now I think. Perhaps they should be turned into dust instead until some nebula-things have been coded into the program? I guess it would take long time to make that.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Magnetar on February 26, 2010, 09:56:50 AM
Fully Customizable Rings:
A function which allows the user, to make his own planetary rings by setting two distances from the selected mass. The first distance describes at which distance the ring begins, the second distance describes at which distance the ring ends. Before the user is done with making his ring, he still can adjust the density of it. ...

I got this working today. This will be in Universe Sandbox 2.

I recently saw this. It think it's amazing. Well done. :)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on March 04, 2010, 03:52:47 PM
Laws of Physics:

Being able to change the laws of physics in US! What you have is a text box for a few laws, like gravity, and the speed of light! Then you can change them. Yes, there is gravity, but (i don't think) that is the law, just the strength.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: deoxy99 on March 04, 2010, 04:49:27 PM
How about that, but you are able to change not just gravity, and the constant "c", but also be able to change magnetism, antigravity, inflation, and orbital properties (like square, circle, ellipse, triangle, polygon orbits)
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on March 04, 2010, 05:01:29 PM
Yes. Eventually most laws of physics
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: deoxy99 on March 05, 2010, 08:15:30 AM
How about the law of cake?
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: Naru523 on March 05, 2010, 04:32:03 PM
It has nothing to do with the Universe.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: deoxy99 on March 05, 2010, 04:54:44 PM
Remember, its a joke.
Title: Re: A couple of suggestions
Post by: atomic7732 on March 06, 2010, 09:47:04 AM
You never told us that? How do we remember?